Monday, October 26, 2009

Reader Twins Questions

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  • Tracy said...
    Hi Valerie! I have twin daughters that are 5 weeks old. We are really struggling with the evening nap and getting back to sleep after the middle of the night feeding. If they take the evening nap, then they seem to really struggle with getting back to sleep after the middle of the night feedings. If they cry through the evening nap and never fall asleep, then middle of the night feedings go much better. Is it possible that they are getting too much sleep in the evening and therefore can't sleep as well at night? Any suggestions? Even more, I'm GREATLY struggling with the lack of time I get with the girls on the Babywise schedule. I feed my first daughter, set her down for wake time, feed the second and then it's time to put my first baby to sleep. I feel like I can never hold her unless I'm nursing her! I hate it!!! Would I be messing up all my hard work if I held them in my arms during the evening nap or another time of day? I want to enjoy my precious babies and feel like I can't because I'm working so hard to feed, watch every cue and hurry to get them back down. I know having twins puts me in a different category, but there has to be a happy medium with Babywise or I feel like I won't ever be able to hold my babies, let alone my husband who is gone all day. I'm really missing them and need some encouragement! Maybe it's just my mommy guilt and lack of sleep, but I feel like I'm missing the joy of my precious babies while they are so young. I welcome your thoughts as soon as possible! Thanks so much!!
    September 29, 2008 7:24 PM
    Plowmanators said...
    Tracy, you could try a shorter nap in the evening (45 min or one hour). You could try to keep them up, but 5 weeks seems young for that to me. However, you are the mom! I am not sure about holding them for a nap each day. Some babies might be able to handle that. My daughter might have. My son definitely wouldn't have. If you do decide to do it, understand it can't last very long. They won't sleep very well in your arms.I understand your frustration. All moms have it, so with two you wouldn't be able to spend as much time with each. See this post for more on that: Spending Time with Baby/Child :
    October 1, 2008 4:11 PM
  • MomWithaDoubleBlessing said...
    Good morning! First of all, thanks for the abundant advice all over this blog. I too reference it a lot for ideas to troubleshoot!I am a first time mom of 10wk (corrected age is 8 weeks) twin boys. My hands are full, and the boys really are sweethearts.We work really hard to keep them on the same schedule (every 3 hours). They are doing really well at sleep training and, unless over-stimulated, can get themselves to settle within 10 minutes most times! Sometimes with no crying at all. (Still working on transitions, but they get it most of the time)My question is regarding night feedings. I'm feeling sad because both of them have slept up to 8 hours a couple times. But in the last week and a bit (as life has gone back to normal since the holidays), both have digressed back to 4 and 5 hours. One of them even woke twice in the night a couple nights ago! I'm trying to think "What have I done differently?!" Is it normal to progress and then digress?Their schedule is:7:30am10:30am1:30pm4:00pm7:00pmDF 9:30-10pmI don't expect them to make it all the way through to the 7:30 feed yet, because that would be 10 hours. I've considered adding another feed into the day (to make it 7 in the day), but trying to get them to go every 2 and 1/2 hours is crazy because they just aren't hungry enough!I breastfeed and supplement, alternating who gets what at each feed. I get them to nurse 20-30 minutes and their bottles are now up to 6oz each, which they usually can finish.When they wake in the night, they always take a full feed, and they eat a full meal at the first meal too, so is this simply an issue of waiting for them to mature? Thanks for your input. I just don't want to miss something and ruin our sleep opportunities!
    January 12, 2009 9:37 AM
    Plowmanators said...
    MomwithaDoubleBlessing,It is normal to go "digress" like that, especially during a growth spurt.My guess it is a growth spurt. They are at the right age for it. Since they are eating well in the night and morning, I definitely wouldn't stop feeding them in the night yet.
    January 17, 2009 4:34 PM
  • Tracy said...
    We were doing SO well on our sleep-training and have had to start over a bit thanks to the holidays. Oh well...I have a question for you and am not sure where to post it. We have our twins on a very good schedule. They are eating every 3 to 3-1/2 hours, activity time, napping very well. They go down at night between 7:30-8pm like champs after a slightly larger bedtime bottle. They have dropped the late night feeding...we found they just didn't want to wake up to eat. BUT, they are still waking up at 2am and then again at 5am like clockwork. Sometimes we can get them to sleep through their 5am, but never the 2am. I've come to accept that our twosome just need to eat after 6 hours (they are measuring in the 97th percentile, so maybe they need the calories!) Would you try to reinstitute the 10pm feeding to get them to sleep until 4am? Or should we just power through and hope that the introduction of solid food naturally solves some of our problems? What are your thoughts? Should I thank my lucky stars that it's so easy with twins? We are very tired, but I know it could be worse.
    January 6, 2009 1:34 PM
    Plowmanators said...
    Tracy, Since the 10 PM feeding was dropped, the night feedings will stick around longer than they would otherwise. I would try to get that 10 PM feeding back in and see if they will eat. Solids take a while before they affect sleeping because it takes them time to actually be able to take in enough food to impact calories for the day. See the blog lable "dreamfeed" for more information on that 10 PM feeding.
    January 10, 2009 1:45 PM


Muldner Family said...

This post gives me a little hope although I only have one. It has been name the problem we have it. He is just now getting over severe colic (is on prescribed drops), suffers from silent reflux (on zantac), gets carsick (use mylanta for long carrides) and now suspect teething is coming. He is almost 18 lbs and 26 in long---a big boy. I am exclusively breastfeeding. I have followed BW to the letter up until acid reflux hit at 2 months. It has been a rough last 2 months and I don't know what to do. He will go to sleep with a little effort--loves his paci---but will wake at 45 minute mark and will go back to sleep in the swing. Some days he is up at 7 (I would rather 8) and is on a 3/3.5 schedule. At night he wakes minutes after laying down and wants more food then will generally wake 1-2 times in the night for food. My issue is: is it okay for him to finish nap in the swing? not sure what else to do have tried all suggestions, why does he wake minutes after laying down then sleep 5-6 hour stretches? Do I continue to feed him 1-2 times in the night?? He was on a 2 1/2 schedule and had the same issues...he just has a longer wake time now (1-1.5 hours).
Please husband works out of town and with a toddler and a newborn that has so many issues I am at the end of my rope.

Tracy said...

Hope you don't mind me chiming in. We have 13-month old twins, and are a Babywise household with much success (I think.) I can't imagine how hard it would have been without our routine.

Tracy#1 - When my twins were younger, I did hold them for one nap per day for some cuddle time. Truth be told, I napped during that time, too. I usually put one in a bouncy right next to the couch, and the other one laid on my chest. It was WONDERFUL. I think it's fine to do that as long as you're consistent with your other naps and ESPECIALLY nighttime sleep. Ours were in their cribs from the time they came home on. That special time with them is very fondly remembered. Oh, if only they'd cuddle with me now like that!

Momwithdoubleblessing and Tracy#2 - My twosome are in the 95th plus percentile, too, and I will tell you, we had a lot of sleep regression over the months. We'd have stretches where they slept very well, and then all of a sudden for a couple weeks they would start waking for extra feedings. We had a hard time getting them to drop some feedings, too. I do attribute it to their state of constant growth. Plus, there are two! You might not notice as much if only one baby had a bad stretch, but those bad stretches seem exponential when there are twice as many of them. Just hang in there, and trust that it will change. Quickly. And for the better. We did keep the dreamfeed for longer than many because it did help us drop that 2am feeding. Ours did NOT wake up for the dreamfeed, but they would suck down a bottle. Awesome.

Solids really had little effect on our sleep.

Hope you don't mind me chiming in. I was excited to see this post since so few of the twin moms I know have followed the principles of Babywise.

dani said...

I thought I'd offer my advice, too. My girls are now 2 years old now. They also hit the 97th %ile by 4 months; funny how many of us have that experience!

Traci #1: I remember wanting to hold them, too. I felt bad that I wasn't interacting with them more but I was reassured that simply feeding them and changing their diapers might be enough contact. Have you tried tandem feeding? Around that age I found we were all good enough at breast-feeding that I could start doing them together (on an Anna pillow). Bottle-feeding at the same time was more difficult (really!) but then you can have them on the same schedule and get that 30-min overlap back.

Momwithdoubleblessing: To offer a different perspective: our girls liked to sleep from 7 pm - 3 am. We started waking them for a 10 pm feeding but they still woke at 3 am and then were in the habit of waking at 10 pm, too. They did finally drop the 3 am feeding (one at 4 months old with some crying).

Plowmanators said...

Muldner Family,

Yes, it is okay for him to finish naps in the swing with the reflux issue. I did that with my oldest daughter.

Reflux is hard; it requires more patience and more flexibility, which is hard when you have more than one child. Don't hesitate to use the swing while you need it. See the label "reflux" for more help with that.

Plowmanators said...

Thanks for your thoughts, Tracy!

Plowmanators said...

Thanks to you, too, Dani!

Each of my neigbors have twins (one set on each side of me). They both comment that it is hard to have to divide your time between them because you love both of them so much. My friend said they would both be crying wanting to be held and she would look at them and think "I love you and I love you and I can't make both of you happy right now!"

moosetracks said...

I'm not sure that this is the place to leave my question, I'm not really blog savvy :-)

Here's our situation. Coming home from the hospital with twins, obviously feeling overwhelmed, I plum forgot that I was planning on using the baby wise method. The biggest thing that we had mixed up was we were doing feed, sleep, awake. So we had it backwards, and sure enough both little guys were wanting to eat every 2 hours or less. After Thanksgiving and the craziness of having my parents stay with us, I remembered, "Babywise!" So for the past 5 days we have been in the "Starting late" phase. My babies are 7 almost 8 weeks old. So far both my husband and I LOVE knowing what to expect, and I notice a difference in the disposition of the boys, much happier, and less reaction to the reflux issue my little guy has. My biggest frustration is nap time. I will put the one boy down no sooner than an hour after he has begun nursing. I let the grogginess progress a bit and then put him down barely awake, yet awake. Sometimes both boys are tired at the same time, which is great and that typically goes better. But then many times I have had one boy still crying it out, when it's time to put the other boy down. Then boy 1 wakes up boy 2 and sometimes crying can ensue for 30-45 mins. Now this is probably no more than 2 times a day, yet can be very frustrating when one or both ends up being robbed of a nap. They are still sleeping in the same crib and in our room. We know this will need to change in the near future, (When they start rolling over). Both my husband and I prefer it this way for now, I can see how this might effect night time sleep, but am pretty sure that this would not effect nap time. The boys go typically between 5 and 6 hours before waking up to be fed sometime in the early morning. I would appreciate any input!

dani said...

moosetracks: you've probably heard this advice before but if you can possibly get them napping at the same time, it will make your life much easier. One of my girls, A, got tired first so I would put her in her crib and put the other one, M, down as well. Usually I thought there was no way M would go to sleep as she didn't seem tired at all, but she almost always did. I've realized that M is the kind of child who never *appears* to be tired and, if I had only had her, I never would have known when to put her down. I know this doesn't work with some twins, but it is worth a try.

We eventually moved from the flexible 'routine' to a more clock-based schedule (probably around 6 mos) to keep them synchronized. That way, when one woke early from a nap I didn't have to agonize about waking the other or feeding the first, etc. I just waited on the clock, and they did pretty well.

Also, around 5 months we moved one into a different room for naps (in a pack-n-play in our room). They are over 2 years old now and we still do that; they rarely wake each other up (even when screaming) at night, but they just don't sleep as deeply during naps.

moosetracks said...

Dani, Did you breastfeed? And if so Were you able to tandem feed your twins? I am able to do that in the evening and on weekends only, since I'm the only one at home and don't have consistent help during the day. Unless someone has advice on being able to manuver a tandem feed for 8wk olds without a second pair of hands...if you do!...let me know! haha. Another was awake time accomplished with "M" Unless maybe did you feed M first?

dani said...

I did breastfeed. I started doing tandem feeding when there was an extra pair of hands, then started trying to do one tandem feeding a day by myself. I found it easiest at the beginning to sit on the floor, leaning back against the couch. I think I put a long body pillow behind me, as a 'stopper' to keep the babies from sliding off backwards. I also propped up the feeding pillow with bed pillows underneath each side, so it wasn't just balanced on my lap. And a final pillow to the side of it all, as the "holding deck" for one baby. I'd put one baby on the holding deck, arrange myself and the other baby on the pillow, lift the first baby from the holding deck and latch them both on. I used the propping pillows under the feeding pillow to get the whole thing high enough so they could be latched on without me holding them, so I could burp one with the other still attached. Make sense? It was definitely awkward (and required modification as they grew) but I realized pretty quickly it was easier than feeding one while the other screamed.

As for wake time, we always did it together. I'm not sure I understand the question. You can email me at dani.coleman
if you want.

Plowmanators said...


Hopefully Dani was able to help you out (thanks Dani!). I don't have twins experience. I have a friend with twins (well, several, but this one in particular) said that with CIO, they just got used to each other.

If it were me and they were waking each other up, I would move them to separate rooms for naps but keep them in the same bed for night. Most kids (no matter the age difference) will do fine for night in the same room, but not naps. Good luck! Let me know if you still have problems and I will post your question as a "help a reader out" question.

Lauren said...

i am in need of some help as well- i have 4.5 month old twin boys and we have been doing babywise since they were born. they are on a great eating schedule and sleep from 7 pm to 7 am with a dreamfeed at 10 pm [they don't even wake for this- just drink, although lately it has been decreasing in amount]. they eat at 7 am, 10 am, 1 pm, 4 pm and 6:30 pm plus the dreamfeed. they are still taking 4 naps. off and on over the past 2 months we have had some nap problems. first it was baby b who would only sleep 45 min so we separated them and let baby b CIO. it got better for awhile so we put them back together. stayed great for 3 weeks. now they are both back to 45 min naps even if we separate them. we try to let them CIO but for their first 2 naps they both wake and just talk to themselves for up to 30 min. they won't fall back to sleep. if we get them up, it is too early to eat as they are not really hungry yet but they have problems staying awake for more than 1.5 hours at a time so it is hard to get back on schedule. what can i do? they just started eating cereal 2x a day and are eating between 30 to 35 oz of formula. both are about 15 pounds but very long- 26.5 inches. thanks!

Plowmanators said...

Lauren, Ah. 4 months. See the blog label "4 month sleep problems" as well as "wonder weeks." I think you should find your answers there :)

Jenny Borders said...

I decided to post on this label since I'm a mom of twins, too. Even though my question is really only about 1.

My b/g twins are 13 months old (12 months corrected). About 2 months ago, my son had surgery and we spent 5 days in the hospital. He then had to spend 3 weeks in arm restraints to keep his hands out of his mouth to let the surgical site heal. Naturally, this disrupted our wonderful sleep habits that Babywise helped us form! We got through the holidays and a few other disruptions, and are back into our normal routine. All restrictions are off. But my son is waking pretty much every night. I can't explain why. We've tried CIO, but he only upsets himself further. Sometimes a diaper change will calm him down enough to help him to go back to sleep. At this point, because his sleep has been disrupted for so long, it's almost like it is out of habit.

Thankfully, my daughter is a champ sleeper and sleeps through it all. But does anyone have any suggestions for what I can do to break this habit? He has slept through all the way a few times, but it seems like he'll have a few days on, then a week or two off!

Thanks so much!

Plowmanators said...


Do you have him fall asleep on his own in the day? If it were me, I would work on daytime naps so he can learn to self-soothe while you are awake anyway :)

I would also consider the wake to sleep method described by the baby whisperer in her book "the baby whisperer solves all your problems."


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